One of the most interesting things I’ve found in studying the ‘gun issue’, is how incredibly complicated the various aspects can be.
In my last post I looked at the math to answer whether the availability of firearms “produce” tragedies like the recent church shooting in SC that saw 9 murdered by Nameless Scumbag, or the Hartford Distributor shooting in 2010 that saw 8 killed by a different Nameless Scumbag.
But in the interests of simplicity I left out a few things.
I was recently informed that it’s the availability of firearms in the U.S. that produced the tragedy in a church in S.C., when Nameless Scumbag shot up a bible study.
If my Gunsmithing I instructor is correct….
If you read SF/F you might be aware of a flame war being conducted online about the Hugo Awards.
This is an award from Worldcon, its former recipients are giants in the field.
And people who consider themselves ‘rational’ science-fiction fans are losing their scheisse all over the place.
Not that this is surprising, the petty little feuds among the various groups of local fans is the biggest part of the reason I stopped going to SF Cons in the 1st place.
But still, if you are going to engage in Hippodrome factionalism couldn’t you at least refrain from the critical thinking fails famously characterized by the Salem Witch Trials?
I’m not going to do a “from my viewpoint” summation at this time, maybe later.
I do want to point out that if people spent half as much time actually listening to the other side that they spend demonizing the other side, a lot of the really stupid stuff wouldn’t ever see the light of day.
It’s to bad the Santa Barbara spree killer didn’t know it’s against the law to bring a firearm on campus.
I know, let’s pass another law restricting law abiding citizens, that will fix the problem this time for sure!!
Why don’t I believe that?
I’ve pretty much stopped watching Television in favor of the internet but I have a DVR now & have been saving South Park episodes. Sometimes I forget to fast forward through the commercials which has raised some questions about the sanity of some corporations P.R. Departments
Starting with Burger King’s commercial for their free small coffee, which get’s you your own guitarist & back up singers.
What would you get with a free LARGE coffee, a 10′ phallus & your own private jet stocked with roofied Dallas Cowboy cheerleaders?
Then there is the Doritos commercial, which shows the promise of nacho cheese flavored corn chips is all you need to turn big hairy macho men into dainty gowned pretend tea drinking dancing transvestites.
The most disturbing however is from Taco Bell. Why do you need portable nachos? Well if the parents of the under age chick your banging come home early….
Another mass murderer shoots up a gun free zone, a schizs who slipped through the system brought a shotgun to the Naval Yard & killed 12 defenseless people who were denied their right to Own & Carry a firearm for self-defense
Tamara Tabo writing for the Above the Law http://abovethelaw.com/2013/09/some-thoughts-on-the-washington-navy-yard-shooting/blog blog has called for more & better mental health screening, finding better drugs with less dangerous side effects as well as more effective laws denying the mentally ill the right to Own & Carry arms
I’m not going to go into a big long rant about all the defects those solutions contain
I’m just asking, can’t we please try the common sense solution? Anyone who wants to own & carry firearms for self-defense should be allowed to (absent any disqualifications from laws already on the books) We already have Laws in place to cover who can own & carry guns, & the circumstances under which fire-arms can be legitimately & legally used & under what circumstances usage is forbidden & criminal
Just one simple change is all it takes, an experiment of sorts, give lawful citizens the choice to practice defensive carry if they want to, give them a 3rd option to add to “run & try not to die” & “hide & try not to die”. Given the number of defenceless people who have been murdered in this country in ‘Gun Free Zones’ it’s hard to see any other viable option
It’s the simplest common sense solution, please lets try it!
I’ve been doing the dozens with this gerbil on a youtube video comments page & it finally got to the point that my response wouldn’t fit into the 500 character limit
I posted 2 pieces as comments but decided to post the rest here so I wouldn’t take up an insane amount of room [I may have been a little tardy in that regard] & edited for flow & punctuation =)
How do you do this day after day?
Twist words, lie, deflect & defame
Respond to simple requests with insult, innuendo & irrelevancy
This thread started 3 weeks ago with your lie that Mr Whittle said 100 lives saved for every life lost & “Goebbels would be proud” snark
Your next lie was claiming Mr Whittle said 12 Million Germans.
Over 21 comments, 12 by you & 9 by others & you’ve told the 12mil German lie 4 times & made some really bizarre claims about the effectiveness of guns held by state actors & the ineffectiveness of guns held by private citizens, as well as pretending every tyrannical assault was a unique occurrence.
In the real world once the Jews figured out what was happening many did fight back & if nothing else tied up resources the Nazi’s desperatly needed elsewhere Which is the focus of VirtPrez metaphor re: leopards & gazelles, dangerous prey impedes predation, whether on the savanah or in the ghetto, the principle is the same
Then you pretend tyranny only describes taxation without represintation, take a pot shot at the ‘Tea Party’
claim the war for independence was about money, which means the revolution was really an inssurection, & the whole tyranny thing is a misrepresitntaion of history by lying American history writers
Then you make a pump fake & admit the revolution would not have been possible without guns but immediately segue into the America didn’t mean freedom & justice for all, because slavery existed & also there’s Vietnam. Poor people going bankrupt from falling ill & dozens of 1st graders shot in the head all to prove that America sucks.
Then you revisit the whole tyranny is only taxation without representation again, next (for maximum confusion) you reference a different thread where you claim that England is a republic. A claim you made to dismiss the American experiment that claimed legitimate government power derives from the consent of it’s citizens as EQUALS. An equality you ignore so you can claim the only people who could vote were wealthy land owners (which is untrue except for a few places in the very beginning) so you can assert that American governance was no different from the British
A claim that ignores the Brits division between noblemen & commoners, which again is the division we rebelled against in favor of equality under the law.
Zimmerman is currently having his day in court, no matter what the verdict is, expect hysterical condemnation from the losing side. This is a good example of Hippodrome factionalism existing even in the 21st century.
Checking the web before posting, if the prosecution loses there is already rumbling that this will be prima facie evidence of a corrupt Criminal System of Justice. The claim is the only way the D.A. could lose is intentionally, by throwing the case. I’m also finding a lot of backpedalling on the MSM websites
I have observed the people who know enough (or think they know enough) about this case to form an opinion, will invariably have strong feelings supporting one side or the other. This judgement seems formed by mere exposure to the discussion about the case than the actual facts of the case, pro or con. Indeed I find it worrisome that people can have such strong emotions about this incident given that much of the discussion involves gossip and innuendo instead of critical thinking skills and factual evidence Seriously, if you’re angry at George Zimmerman or Trayvon Martin, can you step back and ask yourself, what thoughts created my upset? Can I be sure those thoughts are true and not produced by mediapathic reporting?
I have my own bias, when it comes to a shooting, I care more about the justification, (is it self-defense or is a murderer trying to game the system), and less about the actual personalities involved. Spend enough time studying the politics of crime and punishment and you develop techniques that help you maintain a distance from the very real misery suffered by the very real people involved
I guess what I’m trying to say is that I approached the case from a different perspective. I was looking at the ‘logic’ of the incident. I was troubled by the first ‘news reports’ about the case. Opinions were proffered as evidence. One day there would be interviews asking Martin’s mother if they thought Zimmerman was a maniac or a monster, the next they would interview Martins father, asking if he thought Zimmerman should be executed or get life in prison, and a dozen other questions that were just not that relevant to establishing evidence of a crime. What the courts refer to as hearsay was being presented as fact.
Things got weirder, “hoody’s” were all over the news, then it would change and everyone is now talking about Zimmerman stalking Martin. A couple of days later and the new topic is how Zimmerman had profiled Martin (and yes I know the above isn’t necessarily in chronological order). What piqued my interest enough to start actively looking into the case were either the reports on The Smoking Gun &or the OP-EDs of what became known as ‘the Talk’. If you’ve forgotten, this was the story about how every black parent would have to talk to their children and warn them that all white people stereotype all black people.
This stereotyping by all white people would lead them to believe that all black people were dangerous, just from the color of your skin, and how if you weren’t careful, you might scare a white person, who would then shoot you, since white people were all stereotypers. This transcendent hypocritical nonsense was an actual part of the news cycle for a few days, (again I might be wrong on the chronology maybe I discovered The Smoking Gun evidence first)
Smoking Gun? The Smoking Gun is a website devoted to the posting a “Large collection of public documents on crimes, celebrities, politicians, and the FBI”. Their website was one of the first places I found when I decided to do a little research. While there I found 3 pieces of evidence that led me to form an opinion on what was important to me whether or not this was a legitimate Defensive Gun Use (DGU).
- A photo of a Police Officers note that Zimmerman’s back was damp and had grass stains http://i.cdn.turner.com/dr/teg/tsg/release/sites/default/files/assets/zimmerman14.jpg
- Photo of note by a Police Officer detailing his observations of George Zimmerman as having a bloody broken nose and bruised face http://i.cdn.turner.com/dr/teg/tsg/release/sites/default/files/assets/zimmerman15.jpg
- A photo of a Police Note with an eyewitness account of Trayvon Martin straddling George Zimmerman punching him “mixed martial arts” style, during an interview in the 1st hours of investigation .http://i.cdn.turner.com/dr/teg/tsg/release/sites/default/files/assets/sanfordpd1.jpg
Here it might be useful to expound on the difference between objective evidence vs hearsay evidence. Objective evidence is stuff you can point to or hold in your hands, touch, see, hear and so on. Hearsay is pretty much everything else=).
An Anonymous phone call claiming Zimmerman is a member of the Aryan Brotherhood, is hearsay.
A photograph of a LEO’s handwritten note recording an eyewitness account is objective evidence to the fact that there was a report, which may be useful when evaluating the eye witness testimony the report contains.
A photograph of a person is objective evidence, although relevance is determined by when the photo was taken.
Again, I started out questioning the legitimacy of the shoot, and I had quickly found strong evidence that justified this as a DGU. And the fun wasn’t over
- A picture of 12 year old Trayvon was used to depict a cherubic cheeked little boy, instead of a current picture of the 17 year old, 5′ 11″, 156 pound young adult.
- NBC was caught editing Zimmerman’s 911 call from that night to cast Zimmerman in a bad light
- CNN reported Zimmerman had used the racist epithet “coon”, then had to retract it when it was shown the word was cold.
- Although there has been considerable media attention linking this incident to Florida “Stand Your Ground Law”, and prosecutors have shown that Zimmerman attended classes where the “Stand Your Ground Law” was analyzed, it is irrelevant to the case at hand and the defense isn’t expected to use it in Zimmerman’s defense. Simply put, you don’t need to invoke stand your ground when you’re flat on your back
- The media has constantly labeled Zimmerman as a ‘Neighbourhood Watch Captain’ and reported he was ‘On Duty’ patrolling the neighbourhood. Actually, when he spotted Trayvon, Zimmerman was leaving the neighbourhood en route to the grocery store
- A factor in the original (evidence based non-political) decision to treat it as DGU? When told the struggle between Martin had himself had been caught by a video surveillance camera, Zimmermans response was “thank God”. There wasn’t a video, remember the Police can tell you any lie they want when investigating you for a crime
- Trayvon Martin, who used the sobriquet No_Limit_Nigga on social media, spent time extolling the virtue of a concoction known as Purple Drank, made from cough syrup, a watermelon flavored drink and skittles. Martin was filmed buying watermelon tea and skittles at a 7/11 shortly before his death.
- Martin’s social media chats reference illegal drug use, blunts (cheap cigars filled with marijuana) were a common topic, note THC was found during Martins autopsy, and one of the reasons Zimmerman called in was Martin acted stoned
- Martin’s social media accounts show immersion in hip-hop aka thug culture and features guns, drugs, etc
- The woman who testified that Trayvon was scared because he was being followed, wasn’t scared enough to call for help when she lost contact with Martin
- And on and on and on
This is just a smattering of the problems surrounding the case from my perspective. I am happy with my opinion, that this was a justified shoot that fits the parameters of Defensive Gun Use. What I find disturbing is the behaviour of state actors in reference to this case, although it does happen, politics should not trump the Rule of Law. There is more evidence of malfeasance by state actors in pursuing this case, than evidence George Zimmerman purposefully killed Trayvon Martin
One last thing, Zimmerman brought the rope they are trying to lynch him with.
If you are ever in enough danger that you need to resort to Defensive Gun Use, remember that after the shots you made to stop the threat to your existence, you are not finished defending yourself. Beyond telling the police you were in fear for your life and acted to stop the threat, keep your trap shut. If you, like George, think you’re safe to cooperate with Law Enforcement Officers, then you might end up in the hot seat. Don’t give statements, don’t take lie detector tests, don’t make video taped walk throughs with the police. It is an unfortunate fact but the police and District Attorneys are not always on the side of the law abiding citizen, and they can tell any lie they want attempting to get you for a crime. Even a half-way decent lawyer can make sure you don’t give them a chance to hook you up. If you choose to practice defensive carry, you need to give as much attention to preparing for the aftermath of such an event as you do your gun handling skills. Find someone you can trust to have your back, then make sure they are cool being your backup. After calling the Law to report your DGU, call your friend and have them come babysit you. You need to make sure they know enough about this area of the law that they can prevent you from giving the Criminal Justice System rope they can tie into a noose
Keep Your Powder Dry=)
Ohio cops encounter an armed Ohio resident.
This is the way it could have gone down instead